Even more corn-ethanol?
Can you really go green by going yellow?Well, gas prices are going down, and that means interest in ethanol is also subsiding, at least in terms of consumers.
Thus, a number of players in the ethanol industry want to increase the amount of ethanol than can be mixed into gasoline, despite the fact that almost every single bit of evidence suggests this would be a bad move for everyone, except those with a direct, vested interest in corn and ethanol.
Isn't it time to start to downsizing corn's role in ethanol, not to increase it?
posted by Dahcredyns at
9:43 AM
8 Comments:
if ethanol is perceived to be a way for us to become more energy independent and import less fossil fuels - then why is this any less good than incentives for hybrids?
Are we being consistent in our support for policies to get us off of foreign oil?
that was my understanding as the primary reason that ethanol be subsidized.
no?
p.s. everything I've read says it take more energy to produce ethanol than it yields...
would that be the reason to do away with the subsidy?
but I also ask.. why corn? why not other crops especially the kind that would grow on less fertile and currently unused land?
you kind of answered your question, larry.
i'm not against ethanol, but I am against any increase in the use of corn-based ethanol.
aside from achieving little in terms of energy yields, its very environmentally damaging.
likewise, it has been an excuse to build millions of large flex fuel vehicles that never use flex fuel, but are allowed to violate CAFE nonetheless.
moreover, according to the data available, it will cause massive engine damage, increase global warming, etc., etc.
but then powering plug-ins from coal plants would also seem to present the same kinds of issues - no?
are we trying to get off of foreign oil or not?
If ethanol came from non-corn vegetation grown on land not used for food production - would it be any better/different?
You can make an engine that runs off of ethanol and use it as a power plant for a hybrid car - no?
if we could create ethanol from vacant lands to power engines made to burn ethanol - to power hybrids - and use less foreign oil.. why is this not at least as good as other alternatives?
coal-powered plug-ins might not decrease CO2 emissions, but they could completely end foreign oil dependency.
corn-based ethanol, on the other hand, could never do that.
we need something like cellulosic ethanol, which i support, and cellulosic ethanol would be more efficient and less environmentally damaging. still, even cellulosic ethanol won't end foreign oil dependency by itself.
so, again, it is corn-based ethanol that I am against.
finally, corn-based ethanol has received FAR more in subsidies than have hybrid cars, and yet it's still a money losing venture.
Dahc - why do you say that coal (a fossil fuel) could end our dependence on foreign oil but ethanol (a renewable fuel) could not?
not disagreeing.. just not understanding...
have we already determined that we could never produce enough cellulosic ethanol?
bonus question: of the two domestic fossil fuels - coal and NG - how would they compare in the "end foreign dependency but don't pollute" comparison?
i'm not advocating that we do that larry, just that we know we have the coal reserves to achieve that end.
cellulosic ethanol, on the other hand, even if it achieves its full potential could not end foreign oil dependence without using all of our food crop land for this purpose according to the data i've seen.
in terms of coal versus natural gas, natural gas is much cleaner. likewise, there is enough known natural gas to power the entire US fleet for at least 50 years and up to 200 years.
yes.. I never have read how much ethanol we could produce from cellulosic ethanol from land not currently used for corn/food production or for that matter what net energy would be after you figure in the energy used to grow, harvest and process it.
but I was thinking of places like powerline rights of way, interstate medians, and interchanges..etc
and then for a given plot of land whether growing an ethanol-producing crop on it would yield more energy than a solar panel.
don't let my devil's advocate type questions throw you off.. it's my own way of trying to validate things...
no worries. i figured as much.
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